The All-Axis Podcast

Navigating Trade Disruptions and Government Relations

• Michael Thiessen, Terry Szmagala

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Trade policies, shifting tariff structures, and supply chain realignments are creating unprecedented operational headwinds for precision manufacturers across North America.

In this episode, host Michael Thiessen sits down with Terry Szmagala, founder of TGS Advisory and a seasoned governmental affairs expert, to break down how manufacturing leaders can proactively navigate modern trade disruptions. Terry shares practical strategies for mitigating tariff-driven cost increases, evaluating onshoring opportunities, and managing ongoing labor shortages. Together, they discuss how shop owners and industrial executives can leverage trade associations and active policy engagement to turn regulatory compliance from a passive burden into a decisive strategic advantage.

Whether you manage an OEM facility, Tier 1/2 supplier, or job shop, this episode provides actionable guidance on protecting margins in a volatile global trade landscape.

In this episode: 
00:00 - Introduction: The Impact of Trade Disruptions on Precision Manufacturing
05:20 - Managing Tariff Surges & Supply Chain Realignment Strategies 
12:15 - Navigating Onshoring Realities & Localized Sourcing 
19:40 - Addressing Labor Shortages Through Policy & Operational Adapting 
27:30 - Turning Government Relations & Trade Associations into Strategic Assets
35:10 - Action Steps for Manufacturers to Protect Margins in 2026

To learn more about TGS Advisory, visit their website.

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Thanks for listening!

Speaker - Voiceover

Welcome to the All Axis podcast from the Experts and Tebis. Each episode we'll talk about technology topics, trends, or solutions that manufacturers need to know in today's rapidly evolving times. Now, sit back, enjoy the discussion and let us know what you think.

Speaker - Michael Thiessen

Hello, my manufacturing friends. Welcome to the All Axis Podcast. I am your host, Michael Thiessen, and this is the place, the podcast, where you can find out all about new technology, trends, uh directions that uh the country is going or your manufacturing is going to be going, uh, looking at forecasts and all those kind of things that normally you would not hear because you're trapped in your four walls doing the things that you are best uh in doing, so which is the manufacturing of your goods. So, as we're constantly uh trying to do on this particular channel, is we're trying to get insights from a lot of the experts and a lot of the people that definitely know more than I do. And so we invite people to come um on this podcast to give us their input, their views, and their directions. And of course, this is no different. And we want to touch on areas that cause you some pain or cause you some issues, and we want to find solutions and what and and give you guidance on what you need to do on a daily basis in your manufacturing sites. So today we're gonna be touching a little bit on a I think a general pain that you're running through or running into uh when you do your operations, and that's dealing with some of the problems with your trade, with of course, when you when you hear about trade, you talk about tariffs, maybe you're purchasing a machine, all of a sudden this machine is now way more expensive than you initially had thought because of all those tariffs that are being compounded on top of it, and then you were thinking, oh gosh, where am I going from there? Or maybe you're manufacturing things where you're now bringing stuff in from if that's China or Europe, and you're bringing it in, all those goods, and you're wondering, okay, what do I need to do? So today we're gonna talk a little bit about uh this type of uh situation that we're finding ourselves in. We talk a little bit about the trade that's uh that's going on. We talk about the manufacturers, you and what you can uh potentially do, as well as the current labor situation when we do all this. And we thought, and actually, this particular gentleman uh he uh he's he saw us on our uh on a podcast and he decided to contact us and say, hey, listen, I've got some some great insight on this. And um, you know what, and and this is always something that we promote. If you have something where you feel that you have an expertise and you can give back to some of the people in the manufacturing world, contact us. We'd love to have you on the on the podcast. So today we're gonna have a um really a um, I'm gonna call it a celebrity that pretty much knows everything about when it comes to governmental affairs and how to deal with this. So the gentleman who we have on this podcast, his name is Terry Szmagala, and hopefully I've I've said the name right. He is the uh founder of TGS Advisory, and he deals with governmental affairs and helps you, you as the company and your business, shift from more of a reactive to a strategic kind of way of operation. And there's an interesting, interesting little quote uh on his webpage that I want to quote you guys because I thought this is so perfect. And it's and he stated it can be easy to view government like the weather. Interesting little point, but it goes on something to react and to mitigate. And oh, is this so true? He is a season C suite executive who led legal and governmental affairs activities for about 140 billion dollars manufacturers. Today, Terry advises manufacturing leaders just like you, who are listening, who are realizing government interactions is a strategic priority. It's important to you rather than a compliance of necessity. Terry, welcome to the podcast. I'm really honored to have you on here. Michael, thank you for having me. I'm really excited to be here. So, this this quote that you have on there is so perfect and it's so simple that uh when I read uh when I did a little bit of research on on TGS advisory and what you do, uh it kind of stuck out because it is true when when a new government comes in or a new presidential president comes into every four years or so, things change. And it's like the weather, you never know what's going to happen. And the same thing is with some of the things that we're running into with tariffs and trade, things change almost on a daily basis. So tell me, and some of the listeners that are out there, TGS Advisory Services, what do you do with in your company and give advice to some of the uh people out there?

Speaker - Terry Szmagala

No, it's a great question. I think the most simply stated, what I try to do is translate government into the language of manufacturing and helping manufacturers express themselves to government. So, you know, in my experience, manufacturers and and government affairs people speak two different languages, right? If you right, you think about it, if you're a manufacturer, what are you doing? You're making goods, you're selling goods, it's tangible, it's concrete. You know how you add value when you're a manufacturer. When you get into the government relations space, where do they add value? They value in relationships, they add value in knowing people, how things work, what goes on behind the closed door. It's it's somewhat uh it's not transparent, right? So the two cultures don't talk to each other particularly well. And so what I try to do is bring the two together and help explain to manufacturers how best to get their message across to those people who are setting policy, and at the same time helping the policy advocates understand how manufacturers think.

Speaker - Michael Thiessen

Do you do you feel that today's manufacturers because dealing with the government, nobody wants to deal with the government? I mean, I I think I can say this honestly. And the only time when you reach out to the government is usually when you're already experiencing pain, or you have some problems that you you're trying to figure out, and like you said, they talk different languages and you don't really understand what they're saying, and of course, they don't want to understand you. So, do you feel that today's manufacturers have a better handle on how to deal with the government, or is this still the same issue that we're running into for multiple decades?

Speaker - Terry Szmagala

So I think manufacturers are recognizing that they have to deal with the government, right? So let's go back to a point you made. It's very common for us to react to government when we're in pain. But the fact of the matter is that government is a huge stakeholder in what we do. Like it or not, we we maybe we don't like that, but it's a fact, right? So if you think about it, you know, we have an HR team that handles our employees, big stakeholders that helps us with our employee relations. We've got sales folks that manage our customer relationships, we've got supply chain and logistics that deals with our suppliers, um, you know, finance, all of these functions deal with important stakeholders. For companies that are publicly traded, you've got, you know, institutional uh investor uh relations people. But we generally don't put a lot of emphasis on government. And yet government affects us in so many ways, right? Government regulates what we do, but they also buy from us, right? They they they give us incentive and tax dollars. And oftentimes we haven't really thought clearly about how to manage the government stakeholder, especially with manufacturers. So I'm finding that manufacturers are getting the fact that they need to do it, but not exactly sure how to go about it.

Speaker - Michael Thiessen

Do you mostly deal with smaller companies or do you deal with larger companies? I mean, your background is from a huge company that you've been dealing with.

Speaker - Terry Szmagala

It is, but but I will tell you that the company that I uh was with for many years really is a compilation of smaller businesses. And so a lot of what I do is just as relevant for smaller companies as it is for mid-sized companies. I would actually say that that the value that I can add is oftentimes better for in and more pronounced for smaller companies because they don't have a developed government affairs staff. They don't really know what to do, and they don't really have a budget for it, nor do they want to have a budget for it. Right. So I have clients across the span of sizes, right? From small to mid-sized, uh all the way up to a larger publicly traded manufacturers.

Speaker - Michael Thiessen

And I think it makes sense. A lot of the smaller manufacturers, they feel like they have no voice because they they feel they're so small. So they need to have a powerhouse like you. I wouldn't say need, but they would like to have somebody that can talk for them, that give them also more insights of what to ask and the language that government potentially needs.

Speaker - Terry Szmagala

You know, it's an interesting quote, like, because I would argue that manufacturers have more power than they think. And my value is not speaking for them, my value is helping them find their own voice. And here's what I mean by that. Um, manufacturers oftentimes don't like government, don't trust it, don't understand it, what have you. Uh, but I will tell you that government folks, especially elected members of Congress, your your even your state senators, they love manufacturers. Manufacturers are really, really popular. And and frankly, manufacturers don't necessarily always appreciate that. I, no matter how small you are, there I've never met a member of Congress or a state senator or state representative that won't come and tour your plant, that won't get to know what you do and hear what you have to say. So frankly, a big portion of what I do is to encourage manufacturers not to accept government as just the weather, right? Not to accept government as something that happens to them, but actually understand that with a little bit of effort, you can engage those policymakers. You can engage with them and share with them your experiences. You know, and by the way, it's not about telling a government official how to vote, it's really giving them the context for these policy decisions that they're making. And if I could just keep going for a little bit on this, on this on this thought, you know, policymakers in Washington, you you can basically tell the demographic of a lot of of members of Congress, right? They're very few of them come from a manufacturing background. They profess to love manufacturing, right? But have they ever actually walked a plant floor? You know, do the, you know, do they understand high-five metrics? Do they understand quality metrics? Do they understand right? You know, you know, maybe they can talk the Gembo walk talk somewhat, but it there's not there's it it's not really authentic. But it it and that's fine. They come from legal backgrounds like mine, right, to be honest. But what it means is that they don't understand always the practical ramifications of the policies that they enact. And what I've found to be extremely helpful is to bring in policymakers, even their staffs, and to say, hey, let me share with you what's happening in the real world. You you've passed this regulation, you know, you're you're pursuing this policy, and I know you intend well, but what's happening here is, you know, X, Y, Z, I'm having a harder time finding labor. There's only one source of supply for this part, and it comes from a tariffed country, and it's really hurting my margins. Telling that story is really, really important because if you don't, no one else will. No one else will. So it's really up to you to ensure that your policymakers, your regulators understand the ramifications of the policies they're pursuing.

Speaker - Michael Thiessen

Have you seen, I mean, you've done this now for quite some time, this relationship building between the manufacturers and the government, where somebody contacts you and says, hey Terry, um, I would like to invite the congressman or senator, whoever it is from government, to come down and see some of the issues they were running into, if that is finding people to work for them or look at the material cost or anything like that. Have you seen, I mean, obviously this kind of stuff is going on, those those types of questions, but what has the manufacturer then gained after that? Do you do you in in terms of quantity or something too qualitatively to see some results?

Speaker - Terry Szmagala

It's a great question. And I would say it really depends issue by issue. There are certain specific and smaller issues that really can be rectified or or or resolved once the policymaker understands the the negative ramifications of something that might not be intentional. So, you know, there was a situation in my in my employer in which uh a state legislature passed a regulation that was designed to do something very good in an adjacent market to ours. But it act, but the way the law was worded, it actually caught our products as well. And it really was not intentional. And our plant, and you know, yes, our company is very big, but the actually the plant there was very small. It was it was relatively small, right? Under 100 people. But we were able to get a meeting with our local state rep and explain the negative ramification of the policy, and we got it changed. Not because you know that the the rep was necessarily afraid of us or we were giving donations or anything, but because the the representative truly realized that the impact on us was not what was intended. And you know, and frankly, the you know, the 80 jobs in his district were important to him. So so that there are concrete ways you can impact smaller issues. Now, on larger issues, you think about tariffs, you think about trade. Oftentimes you you need to work through a trade association in order to advocate for your point of view. And that helps because it makes you much bigger, right? So you you band together with uh issues of common concern and you're able to amplify your voice. And trade associations play a very important role in uh our political life in explaining uh and advocating for positions that are important to us. One of the biggest mistakes I think manufacturers make is not taking an active role in their trade associations. It can be extremely helpful and really a great way to tell your story.

Speaker - Michael Thiessen

Well, it's also a way to get involved in order to see some of the issues that you're running into. Because, like what you said earlier is so true. A lot of the lawmakers or the our congressmen and senators, they don't come out of the manufacturing sector. They they understand what manufacturing is, but have never lived it. So when they pass laws, they do what they do best. And that's talk lawyer-ish and create these uh regulations and laws in place that to them it makes total sense. And it it probably is is a very good law that they put in the books or regulation they put in place that is benefiting the government or the country or anything like that, but it doesn't gain anything on the manufacturer's level, and it could potentially hurt them. And this is where I think it is so important that our manufacturers and the listeners that we have take that really upon themselves to contact the Congress, uh your congressmen or the senators and invite them down. If there is a pain that you're running into, I think we have gone through a lot of the manufacturers over here on the TEVA side, as well as on all of our associations that we're dealing with, that we can identify that yes, a lot of the companies they have issues and they have pains. Through the associations, it's great that they uh communicate this because, of course, associations they can talk for the larger groups and so forth. But even if you're not a part of the association, they can contact people like you and you can give them guidance on what to do. And I think that's very important. You touched on something on the manufacturing side, because we're seeing a lot of change that is happening uh from our governmental officials, from the president downwards, where we're trying to onshore a lot of the manufacturing jobs again from the outside and bringing it in. I mean, that's at least part of the tariff idea behind all of this to make more here in the US. So the big thing is always trying to a how are we gonna onshore this work back here again? And do we have the knowledge and the know-how still from the 20 years ago when we went the other direction?

Speaker - Terry Szmagala

Right, right. No, it's a great question. And there are lots of things that are implicated here, right? So there are a lot of ways we can take a look at this problem. But let's just let's start with the talent issue that you just raised. Do we have the know-how? Well, the fact is that many, many states have local community colleges and trade groups that are designed to provide worker retraining, provide worker training. I know here in Northeast Ohio, where I'm based, you know, there there are worker training opportunities where people can be qualified on CNC machines, et cetera. What's interesting about that though is that the way the money is allocated, the states kick it out to the educators, whether it's uh a community college or or trade shop or what have you. But where's the link between the trade shop and the actual tool and die guy, uh the actual manufacturer? And that's where I see sometimes the link is missing, right? So the government doesn't necessarily know how to reach out to the manufacturer and say, hey, do you need worker retraining here? Right? And then the manufacturer doesn't necessarily understand how to pick up the phone and call and say, hey, is there any government program out there, any funded program out there that can help me train my workers? Now, in in many states and areas, there, including in Northeast Ohio here, there are good organizations that are designed to try to connect those two dots. But the one thing that I would encourage your listeners to ask themselves is if they find something, if they find a need in the worker retraining space, are they actually asking the questions? Are there funding, is there funding available to help in this area? Um that's just one example.

Speaker - Michael Thiessen

I think many companies don't realize that the government has put out a lot of grants. If these are training grants or if it's uh equipment grants and all those kinds of things, they're available. But not many take advantage of it because they don't really know where to get this from. That's right. And I think that is a a very flawed area where manufacturers, unless they belong to an association, then the association can guide them where it is, because the training portion is a huge, huge portion of the entire wheel of bringing the manufacturing back again.

Speaker - Terry Szmagala

Yeah, no, you're absolutely right. And you know, and it goes beyond training, it goes to all sorts of potential local incentives. That's the other challenge, too, is that these incentives aren't necessarily coming from just the federal government. They're oftentimes coming from the state or even the local governments. And it changes from town to town as to what opportunities might be there for funding, which is one of the reasons that I, especially when you're a small manufacturer, that I encourage you to be a member of your local chamber of commerce. Like, you know, we can think of Chamber of Commerce or the business groups as sponsoring the Little League Baseball team or or you know doing good in the community. And that's that's true. But I've also noticed that local chambers really have the best feelers for what incentives are there at the local and state level. And you can you can use the staff of these organizations to help guide you in saying, you know, hey, if you're looking to expand and add 10 employees, there might be a state or a local grant that will give you a tax incentive in order to do that, right? So you you want to make sure that you follow up with that before you commit to those 10 employees so you can take advantage of it's it's things like that.

Speaker - Michael Thiessen

And that's a great place to start with your Chamber of Commerce to kind of uh ask the question of, hey, where can I find or is there any grants available? Is there any tax incentives available for me and my company? Because I want to really get back into the business of manufacturing here in the US again. And I bet you they can guide you in the right direction, even if they're not the place to get these from. Because even in in some of the previous episodes that we've done, we've had companies on that are providing these types of area, these types of funding. And they've even admitted too that yes, not many companies know about that there's free money available. You just need to ask the questions and you need to know uh that this is available for you.

Speaker - Terry Szmagala

Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. Keep yeah, keep in mind the government wants to help you create jobs. That's absolutely that you know, creating jobs in the district, that's the that's the mother's milk of American politics, is creating jobs, especially manufacturing jobs uh in in their districts.

Speaker - Michael Thiessen

Okay, let's let's assume we get the jobs back. Let's assume we have the uh presidents that are building these companies. Where are they finding the individuals? Because let's face it, high school, we're facing more and more just on the arts, not so much on when we grew up or when we went to high school, there were shop, you were dealing with uh cars, you had woodworking, and all those kind of things already in high school. That we're not teaching our young future generations that are providing the jobs after we are retire. What are we doing on that side? Because we need to find that talent that drives our business for tomorrow, not of today.

Speaker - Terry Szmagala

It's a great question. And I will tell you that I think policymakers are figuring that out. And I think, at least here in Ohio, I've seen definitely an emphasis on ensuring that education dollars are focused on programs that generate prepared workers for the jobs that are out there. You know, and it's interesting. I would say that this notion of you can become a manufacturer and go into a trade, or you can go to college is a false choice. You know, you can do both, right? You can do both. You can go to college, get a degree in finance, get a degree in engineering, and still go out there and have a great business running a trade. As a matter of fact, you know, I think that's a great combination to get a finance background, a little engineering background, and then go out and, you know, and manage your own trade or run your own business. You know, I've seen policy changes over the last number of years. I'm on the board of Cleveland State University, and I know that one of the priorities of Cleveland State is to reach out to the local economic community, the local businesses, and treat those businesses as if they are the clients of Cleveland State University. You know, what do you need to see from us? What sort of skills do you need these young men and women to have? And we're seeing programs uh uh evolve and change to address those needs. So the important thing is for businesses to make sure that their voices are heard so that they they express the need for, you know, here's a gap that I see in the next number of years, right? And and we've all had those conversations, right, where we have a technician in our house working on this old boiler, and you know, and he's he's up there in years, and you think, wow, when this guy retires, I think I'm gonna freeze because I'm not quite sure there's anyone behind him, you know. But it's important for that that boiler company to you know uh go out there and try to secure that talent and have conversations with the the local universities and the trade schools and make sure they understand this is a job in demand. Right.

Speaker - Michael Thiessen

I think you made a great combination that if you have a trade, and I'm a big believer in in what Mike Rowe does and getting the voice out there that yeah, you know what, you can make a really good living if you learn a trade. If it's a plumber, if it's an electrician, if it's a house builder, if it's all of those things, because we still need those types of traits in the future, because it's we still we we need plumbers, period. Sure.

Speaker - Terry Szmagala

Well, and by the way, a AI is going to be replacing the marketing and communications rep a heck of a lot more quickly than it's gonna be replacing the guy that's gonna replace our roof or you know, fix our equipment. So there's a certain job security in that as well.

Speaker - Michael Thiessen

Unless one of those robot humanoids come over and take your job away. And well, uh anyways, yeah.

Speaker - Terry Szmagala

No, no, no, right, exactly.

Speaker - Michael Thiessen

But that's but that's and then having the background with maybe a business or finance uh education and behind it, because if you're running a company, you need to know about finances and you need to know about all of those things along with your trade. And I think that that brings a brings up a good combination of things. So now we've got the manufacturing back. Hopefully, we can find the talent to do this. And this is then where, of course, you come in in order to guide them of what to do, because of course, government they want to, at least currently, they want to get all the manufacturing back here again in the US. Because without having manufacturing in a country, we have nothing. We just become a service country, and then we're just dependent on all the others. And having the manufacturing back again. So, do you feel like that some of the smaller companies, because of course, large companies come from small companies as you grow, it's just this natural progression that you see that there currently is an influx of companies starting up, so then we have more and more of these smaller companies starting?

Speaker - Terry Szmagala

Uh you know, I think that there are two things that are happening. I think one is that there are the companies are trying to migrate up the value chain in terms of the products that they manufacture. I will tell you, Michael, I think it's going to be harder for the United States to be competitive on basic commodity products. Um, it's it's simply a competitive disadvantage that we're at vis-a-vis the rest of the world. But what I do see are a lot of very, very highly sophisticated mom and pop manufacturers of specialty parts that go into, say, the aerospace world. Things that, you know, you've got highly engineered, longtime manufactured parts that are incredibly important to our supply chain. And I'm seeing more and more emphasis on that. I see a lot of interest among folks who want to purchase and uh and roll up some of these businesses. A lot of um older family members are finding that their kids might not want to be in the business. And so there's a very active market in handing down these $1.5 million EBITDA mom and pop manufacturers that are incredibly important to our supply chain. And I think that the market for those companies is gonna continue to grow. And frankly, I think the future is pretty bright. I do think that because policy changes so often, it's hard to know. Will these tariffs stay? You know, will they stick? You know, what will our tariff environment look like five, 10 years from now, right? And so, you know, you wonder whether or not people are gonna make investments and bets thinking that this whole tariff structure is gonna remain as it is. I mean, the Supreme Court could strike down this tariff regime in substantial part uh any minute now, right? Uh now that doesn't mean that there aren't ways that you can't put the put some of those back in, but um you get the point. There's there's a lot of moving parts. I think the higher up the value chain you are, the better.

Speaker - Michael Thiessen

Right. Do you feel that, and I'm just gonna say it how it is, do you feel like it's we're a little, what people call it too late to do this? Because obviously these tariffs are now engineered to increase manufacturing again over here and not to encourage to go outside of the US to manufacture there and then bring the goods in from the outside, because yes, they don't have the uh health care and some of the other countries, they can put 10 people onto one job, what it takes over here one, and all those things. Do you think it's a little late to do this or or does it matter?

Speaker - Terry Szmagala

You know, it's a great question. And I and I think it it again it depends on the products we're talking about. I do think there might be, and this might be heresy to some of your listeners, but there might be jobs we don't want back. There might be some low-level manufacturing that, you know, dirty stuff that frankly is it it's great that we don't have to do it, you know. I do think that recognizing that there are certain elements of our supply chain, especially the highly engineered elements of our supply chain that are critical to our defense, that are critical to our economy, that we need to focus on and not just chase the lowest buck. I think that that's that's definitely uh important. I think, by the way, though, that that's been something we've been thinking about for quite a while, right? Right, right. Um there was a fad for such a long time to have this just-in-time manufacturing, and then a hurricane comes in and hits and takes out, you know, the the small island in which you're making all of this one product and and the entire thing shuts down. You know, COVID showed us how susceptible we are to that sort of supply chain, right? So I do think that we're getting there. Uh, I don't think it's too late, but you know, just like the free market, the process takes some time. It needs a balance, that's for sure.

Speaker - Michael Thiessen

Yes. It needs to be balanced out. The industry that you touched on earlier is very near and dear to my heart, aerospace industry. Of course, we know the aerospace and defense world highly regulated. There's a lot of documentation that has to be done, and a lot of regulation and that is uh on there. So we see a lot of manufacturers that are in the automotive world. And we know that the automotive world currently is this up and down roller coaster continuously. First it was uh ice vehicles, then it became battery vehicles, then all the manufacturers had to retool to everything. Then the I then the uh battery mandates went away. Then it would, then all the gee was what are we doing now? We're going back to uh creating ice vehicles and all it's this continuous roller coaster with fluctuation in manufacturing, and then smaller companies don't have any work, then all of a sudden they have too much work, and it's this roller coaster. And what we're seeing, a lot of the automotive mold shops and die shops are recognizing and realizing, oh crap, what am I gonna do if I don't have any work? Maybe I need to diversify a little bit more and look into this monster called aerospace. Yeah. And aerospace, of course, and government are really fairly tightly knit because, of course, an aerospace manufacturer also does not only commercial airlines, but he also does defense work. And when there's defense, there's government automatically intertwined. And of course, we're looking very much at safety, and therefore we want to manufacture them inside the US because of some of the regulations that are there. Do you feel like that that industry companies are contacting you more because it there is so much government intervention into that area?

Speaker - Terry Szmagala

Yeah, there I have absolutely seen an uptick in uh companies in this space wondering how they can actually uh improve their own government affairs. You know, one interesting angle to being in the aerospace world is that you can be an appropriations lobbyist for your end consumer. And here's what I mean by that. You know, if you think about the big OEMs that make the big defense platforms, the Lockheed Martins, the Boeings, they don't have lots and lots of uh facilities all around the country. They've got large smaller number of larger production facilities. But what they do have is an extremely diversified supply chain throughout the United States with small plants and medium-sized plants in cities and towns across the United States. And, you know, your listeners might be one of them. And so it frankly, it's of value to them if you lobby on behalf of them for an increase in the shipset delivery of a particular particular aircraft. If you're making a part and that part is going into the F-35 joint strike rider, you know, it very well may be, you know, it helpful as a customer service to lobby on behalf of uh increased F-35 production with your local member of Congress. And of course, making sure the end consumer knows that you're doing that as well. It's just a small thing that people don't think about, but it's just an example that I offer.

Speaker - Michael Thiessen

Right. I think that industry has become more and more the focus for a lot of the manufacturers because it doesn't matter what you're machining. If you're machining a part for the automotive industry or a part of the aerospace industry, the big difference becomes of you need to be uh certified to do these kind of aerospace type of parts. There has to be a lot of documentation that has to be done. So that side is a little bit more intertwined. And some of the smaller manufacturers, they don't really know where to start and what to do.

Speaker - Terry Szmagala

Yeah, and I and I will tell you, my expert, my expertise is not in helping them get to that point, but I do encourage them to think about putting the effort into entering that market, even though there is a lot of process that goes along with it. Because once you're in there, you're in there. I mean, it it it's it's much more sticky when you're in that industry, right? Than if you're making a commodity product that can be swapped out on a on a on an auto platform.

Speaker - Michael Thiessen

Correct. And and the entire mind, your mindset has to change if you're going into that direction. It does. It absolutely does. And and this is where a lot of our listeners need to listen up to it. If you want to diversify and go into the Euros police market, get in touch with your associations that are dealing with this. Do your research of what kind of a certification do you need in order to X, Y, and Z parts. Because there's a difference between tooling or flying parts or any of those kind of things, there's different regulations that you need to follow and different processes that you need to follow. And of course, then when you get into the defense side, there's another subset of additional items that you need to make sure that you have. It is in and you're absolutely right. Once you're in, it's a it is a very loyal community. And if you can prove that your parts are good quality and that you're delivering on time, it's it's this loyalty is still there. And uh where I see a lot of the other industries, there's this cutthroat mentality that I'm going to the lowest buck.

Speaker - Terry Szmagala

That's that that's that's right. And you know, the fact is that we see in the world today a world in which you just see defense appropriations can continue to increase. And and so that that's just the the way of the world. Uh, you know, we're gonna see uh a remilitarization, quite frankly, whether that's a good or a bad thing for humanity. It is where we're going, at least for for the foreseeable future given world events. So it is it is uh a growth market in the manufacturing world.

Speaker - Michael Thiessen

Well, it's not just here in Europe is the same way. We're seeing that NATO is growing because of all the things that are happening over in the Ukraine area. We know Europe is everything is so close to each other. They need to have uh that security uh in order to defend themselves as well as uh. And then of course we see our own country here that we're we're doing more and more of that kind of stuff. And also, if I look at just the commercial airline uh area, uh Boeing, they have uh contracts for years and years and years to come. I'll be retired by the time they're through with their contracts that they have right now. And and that means a lot. There's not enough spindles in the US to handle all the manufacturing that they already have in the books.

Speaker - Terry Szmagala

That's right. No, that's that that's absolutely right. And they they plan well out in advance, right? And then, you know, the fact is, as a matter of fact, that the aftermarket afterwards is also uh a very lucrative market. You know, these these planes that they put into service, they're gonna need replacement parts. And if you're making those replacement parts, that's uh it's a nice spot in the market to be as well.

Speaker - Michael Thiessen

And then they always come back to you again and say, okay, I need to talk to my representatives in order to get to this particular area where I can do diversify, I can diversify in the aerospace, and that's where they need you. We hope they do. So obviously, we could go on for for quite some time talking about those kind of situations with the trade situation that we've going on with some of the labor and the manufacturing. What kind of advice do you have for some of the companies that are dealing that are right now in the midst of all of those things?

Speaker - Terry Szmagala

It's an extremely challenging environment to be in, obviously. And unfortunately, there's not one set of problems that I can say, okay, here's the problem, here's how you solve it. But what I would encourage manufacturers to do is to think about the problem in the way that they would think about a manufacturing problem. Meaning, let's break it down into its constituent parts, right? Understand and put it and put a process around it, right? Put a process around the issue that you're talking about. So if it's a if it's a trade exemption that you're looking to get because you can't secure a raw material from a country that's being heavily tariffed, map that out and have a very, very good sense of exactly the impact it's having on your business, and then figure out an engagement plan. How are you going to engage? And that might be calling your congressman, it might be acting through your trade association, what have you, but really make some effort in finding your voice. Now, it very well may be that the problem is too big for you alone to solve. And I'm not saying that every business is going to be out there changing the world and bringing their congressmen in and you know changing the future of our tariff policy. But I do encourage everyone to at least give it some thought, right? Don't just assume that they're powerless. That's a huge, huge first step. That's the that's the number one thing that I would say.

Speaker - Michael Thiessen

So, Terry, where can they go in order to reach out to you so that you can guide them in the right direction through your company with TGS Advisory or whatever?

Speaker - Terry Szmagala

Sure. Look, I mean, I I'm glad to speak to anyone to see whether or not it makes if I can add value for them, that's great. Uh TGSadvisory.com is the easiest place to go. You know, TGSadvisory.com, very simple. Uh you can send me an email. Uh glad to speak with you and uh just uh explore whether or not uh government is something that might be able to add value to your operations.

Speaker - Michael Thiessen

I think that's a great way to do get involved. Yeah, contact Terry in order to figure out how can the government help you. Because remember, too, government is there that's supposed to make your life better and not the other way around. Terry, I want to thank you for reaching out to us and uh coming on this podcast and in order to give you insight of how can manufacturers get involved with government and how can government kind of like pay back again to the manufacturers that are out there. So I want to thank you very much for that. Michael, thank you for the time and the opportunity. I really enjoyed it. Oh, same here, same here. Well, folks, you've heard it here. Get involved with your associations, they can definitely provide a voice for you. But don't think that you're too small to have a voice. Reach out to your representatives, invite them to your company, show them some of the problems and the troubles that you're running through. If that's labor, if that's material, if that's the trade situation that you're running through, they're there to listen. Contact with companies such as TGS Advisory to kind of give you some advice on how to interact with uh your government officials or with the government affairs to kind of see what can what can you benefit with all of this. And I think we're right now in a great moment, in a great moment of our history, in order to get some of the manufacturing, and Terry is right, but not all of it will come back, but the manufacturing that we care about and that will create the backbone of this country, that we can bring this back. And this is where I think this is very important for all of you guys to reach out to your government officials to kind of help you along with this. So I want to thank you for all for tuning in to the All Axis Podcast and listen to our advice to what you can do. Uh, we hope that you found this discussion valuable to your operation as well as insightful. If you enjoyed today's episode, don't forget to subscribe. If you listen on Spotify or Apple Music or wherever you get your podcast, ring that bell and subscribe. And uh feel free to share the episode within your network. Leave us your review. We'd love to again hear your feedback. For more updates, follow us on Instagram, on X, on LinkedIn, and all what is left to say. Until next time, keep shaping the future of manufacturing and looking forward to the next episode. Thank you.

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Michael Thiessen

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